Hey, ***opelli, in case you're still reading this and wanting to know where to buy StarLancer. EB games has been selling them for $2 each. Yes that's two dollars. Pretty sure the sale is still on. I know my local EB games still has them. I of coarse snatched up a copy.


Edited by - S.P.L.A.T. on 11-03-2003 05:30:57

Star Wars Galaxies...hm, I wonder.

I get the feeling that Galaxies is going to be so complex and time consuming that I could never conceivably devote myself to it, much like I can't with most MMOGs. I'm also getting tired of the Star Wars universe. Not that I won't pick up Knights of the Old Republic.

And yes, if they went back to the WC1 & 2 roots, I'd certainly be all for a Wing Commander revival. Hell, I just want them to rerelease the Kilrathi Saga again! Damn my youth and not having any money to buy it when it was released! Now I'm older and don't have enough money to buy it off eBay.

crashed97, EA killed off Maxis as well. And yes, Chris Roberts left around the time Microsoft bought Digital Anvil. He went off to some other multimedia entertainment company that dabble in movies, tv shows, and videogames, apparently. I think he was supposed to be working on a new Wing Commander TV series or something. Someone will eventually chime in with the correct details.

X gold for 5 dollars, snap it up. You won't regret it.

XT basically is a trade empire building space sim with a full dynamic economy.

You begin with a single ship and can end with dozens of ships, any number of orbiting factories (all operating in a profit and loss economy with their own freighters and fighters) and a huge transporter to serve as your personal carrier, loaded with squadrons of fighters.

You can fly any ship you own to trade and fight your way across 60 or so sectors.

The graphics are superb.

It's basically a different game to Freelancer, with less emphasis on combat, more on empire building. XBTF has a story, but I'd go straight to XT, which is open-ended. XT is much more of a sim.

I love the X series and i'm also thoroughly enjoying Freelancer, but for different reasons. XT is a more thoughtful game, requiring a lot of time to get the best out of. FL I enjoy for the visceral action.

Can't tell you all how much I'm enjoying this thread
I'm an active member of numerous forums, but this thread represents the best reading in a long time!

I'd like to compliment my [very humble experience of Space Sims by aligning with one of these "granddaddy" series - Freespace, Starlancer, Star Wars or X-BTF !

Privateer , while held in great admiration by almost all of you, is too outdated. Don't get me wrong - for example, I use Mame & play classic arcade games from as way back as '81, but in terms of Space Sims, I want the graphics & audio to dazzle me as well as game play & game world structure.

From the remaing four series, Freespace & X-BTF seem to have less followers. I checked out Descent-Freespace, but the Freespace community seems to be all but dead

X-BTF seems to be alive & well, considering their upcoming title, but few of you have dabbled in the series (making me a bit cautious).... Secondly, I like a balance of trading (building) and combat & if push comes to shove, then I'd prefer a sim on the combat side. On those days I feel like pushing the strategy angle, I load up Homeworld

I was pleased to learn of the existance of XWA (see above - thx 4 the tip, DataDroid!) but it seems that Lucas Arts is quite busy with their new endvours, MMO & what not, so that the X-Wing series will remain a classic .

Which brings us to Starlancer & of course, Freespace ! How connected are the two and would it make sense for me to stop playing Freelancer, buy & play Starlancer first?

When I say, "which one to buy" , it's not really about financial budgets (they are all now budget games in terms of cost), it's about time budget. While somone might recommend playing them all, it's not really feasible time-wise (which I'm sure most of you can relate to!).

Again, thx2all for making this a great thread - I'm enjoying it very much


Traveller - Geneve * Melbourne * Miami * Wien

XBOX: P4 [email protected]/ P4PE/ 512MB Samsung DDR426/ MSI G4Ti4200@305 64M@615/ SBLive!/ WD WDC800JB/ Pioneer DVD-A05S/ Intellimouse Ex. 3.0/ W98SE/ DX9/ nVidia 41.09

GBA: P3 866@1040/ GW FOP-32I/ CUSL-2C/ 512MB Kingmax PC150/ Elsa 721(G3Ti200@220 64M@496)/ Fortissimo YMF744B/ Quantum 313600/ ASUS CDS-500/ iFeel std/ WinXP/ DX9/ nVidia 41.09

Well.. anyone ever played Battlecruiser MIllenium?

It is a pretty open ended space sim, with lots of tinkering and VERY detailed controls that makes you think you're really in command of a starship, though the complicated controls will (and probably has) turn a lot of people away.

And what about the upcoming Starshatter game?

http://www.starshatter.com

Developed by a single person for a long time (5 damned years), with realistic physics, yet more comprehensive controls (though not as complicated as Battlecruiser Millenium) and already a highly mod-friendly game(as I've observed in the demo release), this game seems promising.

I guess we'll have to see about this one as it'll go retail soon.

No offense to DA, but I wasn't particularly taken by Starlancer. Nor was I taken by the Freespace series. There is a long list of reasons why (and if you visit my webpage in the next couple of weeks you'll get to read it), but these mostly stem from the fact that I have played just about all those 'grandaddy' classics that you haven't. Space sims since Wing Commander 4 (maybe 5, but I couldn't really get into it) have more or less chucked out lots of the things that made space sims so engrossing, and I've been left ever since with very stale experiences. Up until Freelancer, that is. FL is the closest you'll get to the vitality of the earlier games. In some ways it's better (aside from the obvious things like graphics), in some ways it's worse. But I think it's the most complete experience delivered in ages.

Anyway. Given a choice between Starlancer and Freespace, I'd go with Starlancer. Freespace 2 is well known for its insane capital ship battles, however (I thought it was all much too confusing, if you ask me, unlike a much 'calmer' X-Wing or TIE Fighter), so that might be something worth experiencing. I pick Starlancer purely because it's a bit closer to the (good) old stuff than Freespace is. It is NOT, however, 'essentially' a modern version of Wing Commander, something it frequently gets called. It bears some superficial resemblances, but that's about it. It's the superficial resemblances, though, that nevertheless give the game a bit more personality than Freespace, which is why I'd choose it over that game. Plus it's just $2 and probably easier to find than a Freespace.

You might not want to listen to me, though, cause I haven't played either game all the way through. At most I've played two or three missions.

I just enjoy talking about this stuff.

Guys,

Some of you say that they will NEVER make Wing Commander 6. I have learned in life that you never say "never." =) One reason I say this is because a Wing Commander game was JUST released for the GameBoy Advance...back in November I think. It is just a remake of Prophecy without the FMV and they added some different missions...but it still offers hope that EA/Origin hasn't given up on us...

Speaking of Prophecy, how about that gigantic wall poster map of the whole known Wing Commander Universe? Wow, what a surprise I got when I opened that thing up...but Origin always threw in lots of goodies into their boxes.

SumerNivek
Killer of Khaja the Fang
Privateer Extrodanaire

Good thread indeed. I've played many of the games you have all mentioned. I remember trying the demo for X-BTF and being blown away! If I recall it had a slightly more realistic physics model than most of the games to date and it really felt like a full sim where you actually needed to dock your ship and such. However, it also overwhelmed me quickly and scared me away from buying it.

Freelancer fits me perfectly right now, I don't have as much time as I used to and so it's great to be able to just pick it up and play for a few hours and actually get something accomplished and have fun.

It's funny that no one has mentioned Jumpgate yet. It's a little MMORPG space simulation that has a completely believable physics engine. In fact, it's so realistic that battles (and even docking) is space for an oldschool X-Wing and Freespace jockey like me were very difficult indeed. The ships carry so much momentum that you can't just turn them like you'd expect. Remember that without air there is no forces applied to the ships hull and wings so changing direction requires the use of thrusters only. For me it was interesting but just not what I was looking for.

Eve Online could be a great game if you have the time for a MMORPG and you want an ecomomy controlled by the players and the abilty to own corporations and build space stations (I think it sounds like a MMO version of X-Tension if I understand you guys correctly). Last a knew I think the control scheme was intended to be similar to Freelancer too. But it's been awhile since I looked at that one. It's due out in April.





Oon-tee-dee!

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And what about the upcoming Starshatter game? ... I guess we'll have to see about this one as it'll go retail soon.

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OMG, that's a tall order for any development team, let alone one person! I just read an old Avault preview which included the game's highlights:

Military space combat sim set far in the future.
Pilot a wide variety of ships, from small atmospheric and space-based fighters, to giant cruisers and fleet carriers.
Missions on planet surfaces and in interstellar space.
Command massive carriers in fleet actions using controls inspired from real-time strategy games.
Several dynamic campaigns set in a persistent simulated universe.
Random, dynamically produced missions based on current state of the campaign.
Three different flight model systems ranging from hardcore physics to arcade-style flight.
Space combat model that is inspired by modern day surface navy and naval-aviation technology, instead of the more common World War II era technology.

Three flight model systems...!!! Space, Air & RTS - all core elements...!!! Unbelievable!!! In any event, all hardcore Space-Sim-ers should buy it in tribute to this dedicated fellow, The Talented Mr. DiCamillo !

What I'm missing here is a publisher , never mind the completion date! His site is scare in terms of such [minor details. I Googled, but haven't seen anything in regards to the business (sales) end of Starshatter.... What makes you think it'll be out soon?

Traveller - Geneve * Melbourne * Miami * Wien

XBOX: P4 [email protected]/ P4PE/ 512MB Samsung DDR426/ MSI G4Ti4200@305 64M@615/ SBLive!/ WD WDC800JB/ Pioneer DVD-A05S/ Intellimouse Ex. 3.0/ W98SE/ DX9/ nVidia 41.09

GBA: P3 866@1040/ GW FOP-32I/ CUSL-2C/ 512MB Kingmax PC150/ Elsa 721(G3Ti200@220 64M@496)/ Fortissimo YMF744B/ Quantum 313600/ ASUS CDS-500/ iFeel std/ WinXP/ DX9/ nVidia 41.09

Edited by - Travelller on 11-03-2003 17:08:25

Ok, ok, this is an odd list & you're probably wondering who & how (or why) it was put together, well, it's a key search of "Space-combat" related games from 3DGamers:

Bang! Gunship Elite
Battlecruiser 3000AD
Battlecruiser Millennium
Close Approach
Darklight Conflict
Dark Ore
Dreadnoughts
Earth & Beyond
Far Gate
Freelancer
Descent: Freespace The Great War
Freespace 2
Hegemonia: Legions of Iron
Homeplanet
Homeworld
Homeworld: Cataclysm
Imperium Galactica III: Genesis
Independence War
Independence War 2: the Edge of Chaos
Lander
Mace Griffin Bounty Hunter
Mankind
nTrap
O.R.B.
Parsec
Phoenix
Planet Iridium
Sinistar: Unleashed
StarLancer
Starmageddon
Starshatter
Star Trek: Armada
Star Trek: Birth of the Federation
Star Trek: Bridge Commander
Star Trek: Klingon Academy
Star Trek: Starfleet Command
Star Trek: Starfleet Command Volume II - Empires at War
Star Trek Starfleet Command III
Star Wars Starfighter
Star Wraith 2
Star Wraith 3: Shadows of Orion
Tachyon: The Fringe
Terminus
TIE Fighter
Wing Commander: Prophecy
X: Beyond the Frontier
X-COM: Interceptor
Xenocracy
X² - The Threat
X-Wing
X-Wing Alliance
X-Wing vs. TIE Fighter
Zero-G Marines

(I just tried to highlight the games mentioned in this thread thus far: Obviously, their list is missing a few classics - I assume it's because they are too old or unavailable).

I just noticed that there are no Trekies here. Or is it that the Start Trek franchise never produced a (worthwhile) space sim...?

Traveller - Geneve * Melbourne * Miami * Wien

XBOX: P4 [email protected]/ P4PE/ 512MB Samsung DDR426/ MSI G4Ti4200@305 64M@615/ SBLive!/ WD WDC800JB/ Pioneer DVD-A05S/ Intellimouse Ex. 3.0/ W98SE/ DX9/ nVidia 41.09

GBA: P3 866@1040/ GW FOP-32I/ CUSL-2C/ 512MB Kingmax PC150/ Elsa 721(G3Ti200@220 64M@496)/ Fortissimo YMF744B/ Quantum 313600/ ASUS CDS-500/ iFeel std/ WinXP/ DX9/ nVidia 41.09

Sadly there won't be a Freespace 3, unless Volition Inc. can get the licence back from Interplay. Until then, it's a no-no. ;(

Man, I loved the Freespace's! Best 'linear' space-sim series yet!

<End Transmission>

Well, it seems the majority have yet to experience what is the shining jewel of the space simulation genre, the series that is Independence War. In truth, I enjoyed the original far more initially then the more robust sequel, simply for what the game had depicted. An intriguing story combined with a relatively complex, and accurate, Newtonian physics model allowed it to be forever etched within my mind as a crowning space simulation achievement. Sadly, few played the gorgeous sequel, which, to some lesser extent, furthered the original, thought strayed from its focus. Much more non-linear, and, to date, one of the most beautiful Sci-fi simulations realeased. The cliched story, drab voice acting, shallow economy, and minute selection of ships (5 including one not available beyond the 1st segment (Storm Petrel), and the useless Command section) sadly tore away at the overall expierence, and destroyed what replayability the game may have had. Ships that were available, however, were exceptionally designed and customizable with multiple weapons and peripheral components. With "techo-babble" second to none, the Independence war series has secured its place in the annals of the genre.

For sheer atmosphere, however, this series cannot be missed, especially for the combined bargain bin price of no more then $20.00 U.S.

@Sabretoothed : I think one of the things why Battlecruiser Millenium never took off was due to the poor game design. It plagued with bugs and didn't really have any direction to start off. It had potential, but IMHO it tried to do much in one game.

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Well.. anyone ever played Battlecruiser MIllenium?

It is a pretty open ended space sim, with lots of tinkering and VERY detailed controls that makes you think you're really in command of a starship, though the complicated controls will (and probably has) turn a lot of people away.

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Well, not BM.
But, I did try Battlecruiser 3K...I think that was the title. ???

And, it did look to be an AWESOME game, with many, many, many great things about it.

But yes, it was just too complicated for my puny little mind.
I printed out the entire manual, and had it in hand while trying to play.
But, the constant cross-referencing I had to do, due to everything being stated in abreviations "ATF", "VOS", "ADW", just made it too hard to get into far enough to start enjoying it.

It's a great game!
But, I just don't have the time to take a college course in it just to get started. LOL!