I'm sorry, MD, but as updates go, 1.6 doesn't cut it for me. I really can't comprehend what you were trying to achieve with it. You've doubled all the already grossly inflated ship prices. You've nerfed the decent trade runs. Then you decreased the size of ship cargo bays.

What is the most likely use for this mod? My guess would be multiplayer, since most people aren't going to incorporate any mod until after they've played the original game first. The starter ship for multiplayer is still the Starflier, and the starting credits are still only 2000. Who cares how many extra ships or sectors you add, when players are stuck with a Starflier in New York system?

Given the nerf overkill you just enacted with this update, even existing players are going to find it a chore to make any progress. Perhaps if you had offered up the hyperdrive/warp engines that you hinted at early on, it would've offset some of the new hassles, but even that isn't here. If you couldn't incorporate them, then you could've at least left the profit margins for the trade routes untouched.

Edited by - Ether Dragon on 14-06-2003 20:28:31

First time i play this mod!Very Good!I like it!I'm replaying single player with it and im kicking everyone i see.
But...i've found a bug.Sometime when i ask for a rumor in a bar the "Rumor Window"its empty.
The icon over the npc say that they have a rumor.

E.D. wrote:
"I'm sorry, MD, but as updates go, 1.6 doesn't cut it for me. I really can't comprehend what you were trying to achieve with it. You've doubled all the already grossly inflated ship prices. You've nerfed the decent trade runs. Then you decreased the size of ship cargo bays.

What is the most likely use for this mod? My guess would be multiplayer, since most people aren't going to incorporate any mod until after they've played the original game first. The starter ship for multiplayer is still the Starflier, and the starting credits are still only 2000. Who cares how many extra ships or sectors you add, when players are stuck with a Starflier in New York system?

Given the nerf overkill you just enacted with this update, even existing players are going to find it a chore to make any progress. Perhaps if you had offered up the hyperdrive/warp engines that you hinted at early on, it would've offset some of the new hassles, but even that isn't here. If you couldn't incorporate them, then you could've at least left the profit margins for the trade routes untouched."

There are still profits that can be made, check the post on the comments section. also there is a decent freighter u can start with, the FEDEX, and it's priced at 80000+equips(about 100k). as i told u there try geting to california or Texas, but especially willard station have the best prices for missions, and strike missions against multiple WP's give 4-6 deep scanners each.
I nerfed the trade route exactly becuase i had a lot of complaints from MP server admins that players were able to level up to lvl 38 in 2 hours, and besides I didn't nerfe all decent trade routes, like the Leeds-Cambridge one, or try to discover tohers yourself. another tip: get to EFA system as bases there are offering various and good missions, and prices for commodities are very different from the liberty ones.

There are still profits that can be made, check the post on the comments section. also there is a decent freighter u can start with, the FEDEX, and it's priced at 80000+equips(about 100k). as i told u there try geting to california or Texas, but especially willard station have the best prices for missions, and strike missions against multiple WP's give 4-6 deep scanners each.
I nerfed the trade route exactly becuase i had a lot of complaints from MP server admins that players were able to level up to lvl 38 in 2 hours, and besides I didn't nerfe all decent trade routes, like the Leeds-Cambridge one, or try to discover tohers yourself. another tip: get to EFA system as bases there are offering various and good missions, and prices for commodities are very different from the liberty ones.

The Fed Ex costs 170k, not 80k. You can't "start out" with a freighter that costs 170,000 credits! In the unmodded version, the Rhino only costs about 8k. Since you haven't changed anything for a player starting out in multiplayer, they're still using the default economy in a universe that has become so ungodly expensive they'll quit long before they get to your "starting freighter." Of course, since I'd never dream of buying something as goofy as a space-going Fed Ex truck, I'm doubly screwed.

The starting player is just plain hosed. He can't leave New York, because he'll be fodder for the enemies outside of the sector. If he tries, he'll be broke the first time he dies and his cargo is lost. Given the miniscule size of his cargo bay, and his measly 2000 credits, he's not going to be making any grand profits anytime soon, anyway.

Since the random combat missions haven't scaled with the economy either, the player in his Starflier is stuck doing 2000-3000 credit missions. The next step up, before you even get to the "starting" Hornet, is the Patriot at over 40k. I went from being able to do two combat missions, and buying a Rhino, to doing 15 missions just to buy a slightly better light fighter. Of course, that's ignoring the fact that all ship equipment costs have doubled. Just maintaining my Starflier in combat condition (let alone upgrading it) is going to be twice as hard; meaning it's going to take even longer.

Edited by - Ether Dragon on 14-06-2003 23:00:59

"The Fed Ex costs 170k, not 80k. You can't "start out" with a freighter that costs 170,000 credits! In the unmodded version, the Rhino only costs about 8k. Since you haven't changed anything for a player starting out in multiplayer, they're still using the default economy in a universe that has become so ungodly expensive they'll quit long before they get to your "starting freighter." Of course, since I'd never dream of buying something as goofy as a space-going Fed Ex truck, I'm doubly screwed.

The starting player is just plain hosed. He can't leave New York, because he'll be fodder for the enemies outside of the sector. If he tries, he'll be broke the first time he dies and his cargo is lost. Given the miniscule size of his cargo bay, and his measly 2000 credits, he's not going to be making any grand profits anytime soon, anyway.

Since the random combat missions haven't scaled with the economy either, the player in his Starflier is stuck doing 2000-3000 credit missions. The next step up, before you even get to the "starting" Hornet, is the Patriot at over 40k. I went from being able to do two combat missions, and buying a Rhino, to doing 15 missions just to buy a slightly better light fighter. Of course, that's ignoring the fact that all ship equipment costs have doubled. Just maintaining my Starflier in combat condition (let alone upgrading it) is going to be twice as hard; meaning it's going to take even longer."

ED. that's absolutely not true, why don't u give it a try before saying that?
first the FEDEX an the equip cost 170 k, the hull alone is 80k, then there are some other ships between like the patriot that costs 54 k, has 4 guns and can mount lvl 3 shields. also on Westpoint Academy u can get missions at 6000-6800 credits and pirate escape pods are 5000 worth there.If u take missions against LR(liberty rogues that is) u'll get a lot of tasty drops, like the pirate pwprlant(9000 credits).
And so u can see if i'm talking from in game experience, i leveled up to lvl 8 in OpenSP in less than 1 hour and was able to by a 100k+ ship like the cylon HF(4/2 guns, 109k) or the CSV(4/1 guns, 92k) in other 15 mins, and u'll have a Guardian shield included in those. then the road is opened, and u can go to California, willard or even Magellan if u'r brave enough and take some Battleships on. Or to the new EFA system, but there u need a much more powerfull ship...u'll see why.

Well, I am running the 1.6 now and encountering a problem. It seems that in Omicron Alpha there is about a 50/50 chance of the game crashing if you are caught in battle with more than one capitol ship, ie: you run into a battle between Hessians, GMG, and Outcasts all in battleships and cruisers. They also cause a decent amount of lagging in the program with some of the bigger battles where each side has at least 15 capitol ships and 30 fighters. If I wasn't running an Athlon XP 3000 and 1538MB of RAM, I might say it was a system problem with that much in one battle. The way I am having the problem is basically each time one of the battleships in a fleet is destroyed, there will be a 50/50 chance of me seeing my desktop. This would not be a problem in the least if there weren't so many of the capitol ships at Planet Malta basically everytime I go to dock or leave the planet.

eh, i dont see the problem with the raised prices
at least now playing mp might be a challange
the last version it took me 2-3 hours to get a sabre, fully mounted with upgrades and top weapons
then again, i havent tried it yet so yeah..

Same problem as puncharen.After entering Omicron Alpha,i found myself caught in a huge battle.Kusari cruiser versus a LOT of fighters.I push the booster button and point the nose to Malta but after some second the games crashed to desktop.

can someone plz help me find the new systems? i flew around but didn't find them! (liberty and bretonia!) the system would be enough, so I would lokk again *g* coordinates would even be better!

the prices are extrem, but when starting mp just put some more starting money onto your server! then it should be okay!

Great MD. We've gone from being able to choose from a variety of ships after a brief period of play, to having the option of buying a similar ship at 40k, or holding out for an even longer period for an altogether different similar ship at 80k. Why not do away with the whole economy or choice thing, and go back to the Wing Commander days when you flew whatever ship and mission you were given?

Given that you're whole idea of advancment for a new player hinges on the one strategy you've outlined, is there any real difference?

What really burned me was that I'd spent the disgustingly annoying amount of time doing newbie missions to the point where I was able to buy a Hornet in 1.4b, but had to wait for this patch in order to buy the thing. Imagine my delight at finding out that the price had just doubled and that I was going to have to do it all over again.

One simple question, MD: Was it ever your intention to make buying ships so much more limited, and difficult, than what the original game provided?

Edited by - Ether Dragon on 16-06-2003 04:05:04

FYI the new mod is coming along great

We are looking at a release date of the 25th or 26th Why on them odd days you ask? Because I go on vacation for a few weeks afterwards.

You guys are really going to love this! This is really a splended expansion pack!


http://www.homebs.com/flsdk/
Tutorials, Utilties, Mods, and much more.

What exactly is the mod your about to release?

I have an idea, but I don't know if you could implement it into the mod. Or whether it would be a good solution either. So, instead of having to go through that whole problem of adding in fuel and canisters and a fuel system and money spent on the fuel system, why don't you just add on a tax on all goods bought in the game?

I haven't thought out entirely how you could make this work but basically if you had a freighter and landed on manhattan and bought a bunch of water and took off, then the liberty system police could scan your hold, find you have xxxx amount of water that cost you xxxx to buy and then they could tax you on that.

They could send you a message like "cargo ship please pay this much of a tax on the goods in your hold" and then you could select to pay it or you could ignore it and be attacked by the liberty police for not paying it.

then as you fly to the other side of the universe transporting the water, you would come across more police in different systems that might tax you on your goods, that way you'd still make a profit on whatever it was you were selling but still not quite as much.

the trick would be to buy something and then somehow fly the long way around and avoid all the taxes and cargo scans, maybe even having to take some more elaborate large dangerous path all so that you could avoid taxes!

In fact if u wanna know the price for the Hornet remained the same as in 1.4b : 41000. what increased in price was the equipment mounted on it so that's why the price went up.
U think all ships are the same, that's not really true, each ship has its own characterstics, some are faster and nimble, and some more heavily armed and therefore slower and less maneuvrable. Try for example the Starfury and the Thunderbolt and u'll see what i mean. The Starfury outmaneuvers just about everything while the Thunderbolt maneuvers like a majestic bird of prey, but it's able to take out most fighters in a few salvos.
I did not doubled the prices for ALL fighters, just for the better and more pwerful ones, especialy the ones that combined heavy firepower(9+ guns) with a
large cargo hold, 100+. Anyway there are still cheap choices among the orginal ships of the game(take Piranha for ex). As for leveling up it's still too fast after u leave NY, if u take 3-4 strike missions against a base+5 WP's u'll see why. Still, it took me about 4 houts to get to level 25, true only from Random missions, no trade. so it's an improvement here, no more very quick leveling up.
U say the ship prices are too high, I say maybe that's true but the good thing is that they are available at any level and the only thing u have to do in order to get them is work...and fight of course. that's the essence of FL.
As for those hyperdrives, for now there is no other way then the dual engine mount in yhe ship's package, the game does not allow to dismount and remount the second engine even with multiple Engine hardpoints.
BTW, more of these "similar" ships are going to be available soon, like the Kyle Katarns "Moldy Crow", its premiere ship from Dark Forces(a Vanguard Gyre Scout Ship) and the Tie Phantom or V-38 Assault Fighter from Rebel Assault 2. The Moldy Crow is ready while the V-38 is still in building stage by Free Spirit.
The combined expansion pack it's coming up soon indeed and it's gonna have everything is here in Rebalance and much more as well. u'll see.

mike y do u bother talking about a ships cost with no stuff on it if u can't buy it like that who cares? if u can buy it with just the shell please tell me where

if your not wasted the day is