Modern Weaponry

Tue Feb 10, 2004 9:50 pm by Warlord Bob

Boy I've been missing out on this thread. The topic has changed subtly so many times

Taw, I'd be quite happy with any toy one would put in the open ocean. Than again, perhaps my aspirations are too low

I miss the days of ww2 (even though I wasn't alive). That was the last great war. Horrible mind you, but (as history remembers it) there was good and evil, and men, not machines, fought and won battles. Great things were acomplished. Liberty ships were being launched every few min. from the shipyards that had comissioned the (almost) last real big gun warships. Submarines were silent and unknown till they struck, and fleets of 400+ bombers rained dumb bombs apon enemy targets.

Now we are trying to chose how we maim our enemies, since we don't want to kill them and they themselves aren't all that bad anyway. Battles are fought from miles away with new fancy tanks and GPS. One bomb can do the work 200 were needed for in WW2, simply because of acuracy. Aircrews in some cases don't even leave home! Just fly over, drop the munitions, and fly back without landing. The navy launches cruise misiles and maintains aircraft carriers. The enemy hasn't got one to speak of. Heck, no troops to transport really, the airforce does it, and faster too (tanks and all). No air raids for shure. They are seen before they leave the ground. And that's just our side.

More often than not the enemy hasn't a chance with conventional weapons. Like I said, no navy. A small air force, but they don't see us AT ALL! Stealth. And the new artilery makes short work of targets 10 miles away.

Perhaps it's all for the better, but I can't help but feel I've missed some of the romance. They really are the greatest generation.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 12:21 am by Tawakalna

Modern war isn't quite so bloodless as you make it sound, Bob. While smart weapons and the latest hardware get all the publicity, the reality is still men on the ground. While the pace of battle has gotten faster and thats where the technological advantage comes in, that can blind a casual observer from the realisation that once the groovy video recording and the emplaced reporting stops, and its getting awfully quick now, the bloody slog goes on.

that's what's happening now, of course.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 4:01 am by ~Corsair#01~

My favourite weapon is always gonna be Nerve gas. They can't arrest you if there's no-one left alive...

"Dragons. They don't scare me.
Insectivores, aren't they...?"
The Soddit

Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:40 am by Indy11

@Corsair
Spoken like a true terrorist.

@WLB,
Sorry if this sounds too much like a sermon but all we are able to do now with all this technology is to kill more people faster than ever before. Our skills are such that we can, if want to, maim people for life rather than kill them, faster than ever before.

I'm really not very proud of these accomplishments but of more concern is to consider and realize that we seem actually to have the need to be able to do this.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:51 am by freighter fighter

i would like a fedora hat, a tommy gun and an italian accent

Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:31 am by Tawakalna

and if anyone genuinley believes that "smart" technology saves lives, look at the disproportion in casualty figures. First Gulf War, the Allies lost what was it, a few hundred in total?; the Iraqis lost 170, 000, something like that. Somalia, Afghanistan, Iraq 2003, enemy casulaties are an incredibly high magnitude above Allied/American dead and wounded. So modern warfare is (as i said before) extremely destructive.

btw i wouldn't suggest to the Iraqi boy who got his arms and legs blown off and his entire extended family killed by a "smart" bomb that "smart" weapons save lives. i think he'd be likely to shove one of his artifiical limbs up yer jacksy.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:51 pm by Esquilax

I would have to agree with Taw and Indy. I find it interesting that the "precision bombing" in Iraq was so imprecise. I guess the Yanks should go back to the drawing board.

Note: I hope that no-one believes that I am advocating war or the use of weapons, however I have noticed that weapons have a seemingly romantic view among the general public, and this has proven true in this thread as well. I have noticed that the public do not consider the uses of such weapons, and like them because they "looked cool" when glamourised by Hollywood.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 5:20 pm by Indy11

Well as far as precision bombing with smart bombs is concerned, that's just an over inflated and hyped version of what happened in PG 1. Most of the ordinance dropped on Iraq in PG 1 were of the vintage Vietnam variety.

Tons and tons of bombs from high altitude B-52s and Daisy Cutters trundled out of the backs of C-130s in the southern Shiite occupied marsh areas as well. These weapons are not smart. They are just damned destructive in a very indiscriminate way. I don't know if they had the desired effect on the Republican Guard whose reported positions received the brunt of this stuff but whatever was there, didn't stay in one piece for very long.

I've been very concerned at how sanitized the offensives have been portrayed in the domestic media because no mention has been made at the cost in Iraqi lives that these actions have exacted. Certainly way more were killed in PG 1 than in PG 2. But more have died than has been reported.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 5:34 pm by H.Q. Victor

Most of the modern worlds weapons are very efficient at killing. Everyone will play with something to make it faster, stronger, meaner, quicker. The "smart" weapons do DO their job for the most part. The intent being to go after particular targets rather than like Afghanistan with the daisy cutter which hits everything around it. And, it is VERY unfortunate that such weapons are even needed. But in this world, someone will always want what someone else has.

Finalday

Until that final day. /Keith Green\ (1953-1983)

Wed Feb 11, 2004 7:08 pm by Warlord Bob

Don't get we wrong, war IS hell. Yes we are getting better and better at killing each other, and faster besides. Waeponry is horribly destructive and always has been. I guess the romance I refered to is sort of like the phrase "Things arent what they used to be and probably never was". But think about it...

The battleship was the king of the seas for a good 50 years in one form or another. Some of the biggest, most, well, macho guns in the world, 12 of them perhaps.

The united states air force in WW2 had thousands apon thousands of B-17,29,24,25,and other bombers. Now I doubt we've over 1000 or 2000.

Shure the supercarriers are pretty impressive for thier size, and the fighters for thier abilities, but the feats man now achieves no longer strike me as "awesome". There will quite probably never be another Normandy. Never again will the sky for miles be black with aircraft or white with parachutes. Never again will great naval battles between good and evil take place involving big gun warships, such as the one resulting in those wrecks you dived Taw.

In WW2 the entire country was united behind the cause. Nobody bickered about wheather we should be "over there" or if our president was doing the right thing, or if we were doing a bad job somehow in killing the enemy. Now many immigrants expect signs and things to be multi lingual so they don't have to learn english. Do you realize how repulsive this is to me? People used to dream of learning english and coming to the new world. It's like we've lost some of our national identity/pride. Today I saw a mustang painted out with red white and GREEN with Mexico written all over it. Wrong country *******.

Ok, I'm shutting up now. Starting to rant.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 7:14 pm by Indy11

WLB said:

Now many immigrants expect signs and things to be multi lingual so they don't have to learn english. Do you realize how repulsive this is to me? People used to dream of learning english and coming to the new world.

That's interesting. You're in Texas right? Sounds like what was going on in New York in the 70's and 80's. That's stopped now. Reason being there are so many different languages spoken in NYC that, now, everyone recognizes that its English that is the lingua franca (I couldn't resist tweaking all you francophobes

) for everyone to be able to get along.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:13 pm by H.Q. Victor

Indy, its like when I was in High School. We took a trip to Europe and we had to learn 4 different languages to get by. French, German, Italian and Spanish. It seems right to expect those who come here to do the same and learn english. They canstill speak what ever language at home, but they should, like all people, to broaden their experiance.

Finalday

Until that final day. /Keith Green\ (1953-1983)

Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:37 pm by Griffon_26

For anyone who thinks war is just technology thrown at each other from far off, they can't be farther from the truth. A great many people get army daze and join the military (bombs, cool explosions, cool guns, fast planes etc) when they actually come out to fight, a great many of them get sick. They just get sick...war is terrible. All that cool technology/ honor/ valor/ cool guns that you see in the movies or whatever means nothing now, its just terrible. The weapons and tactics may change but war stays the same, its no more or less bad now than WWII, or Horatio and his bridge.

Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:44 pm by Stormtrooper112

like i said in other post im interested in WW2 stuff so the most interesting thing i now of were the Lufftwaffe's with jet rockets they said it went 750 MPH

For every TIE Fighter you destroy,a thousand more take its place-Anonymous Imperial TIE Pilot

Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:52 pm by Warlord Bob

@Indy - Yup. It's all those (censored) now days.

@Griffon and everybody in general - This is my little disclaimer: While I admit to romanticizing it a bit, don't mistake my attitude. War as we know it is and will always be hell. Any glamor attached comes from gov. propoganda, movies, media, and the fact that heroic deeds are in fact performed.

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Modern Weaponry

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