for my skinning i use Paint shop pro, i have been using it since release 6 or 7 its now on 9, its not as versatile as Photoshop but i find it easier to use, it retails for around 80 dollars in the states, i believe, and in england you can pick it up for under 20 quid if ya happy to use older versions, it certainly has done my models proud in the past

Help Please!!

Hey, im new to the game and design....anyways, i downloaded 3ds max and am in the process of installing it. its asking me wat graphics driver setup to use: software, open gl or direct 3d and im not sure which to pick...any1 that is familiar with the program and could offer any help would be greatly appreciated..thx and happy gaming!

We were liberated from the fold, that's all, and the world looks the same. And history isn't changed, we're all just part of the game.

Um, use whichever one works best on your rig. Direct3D is, I believe, the default with Max.

thx argh! i chose openGL...i did a google search after i posted here and it said it was the best way to go if your card supports it...well i tried it and it worked *sigh of relief*...ty again as this is my first week in the world of freelancer. im actually still waiting for the game to come in the mail..lol. i did download the programs to start modelling and completed my first ship...after a week of reading how to do it hehe..im looking forward to showing it to you all as soon as i find out how to upload lol...anyway have fun!

We were liberated from the fold, that's all, and the world looks the same. And history isn't changed, we're all just part of the game.

i followed some1's elses example photos above and tried thier site for my upload...lets give this a try...bare with me

im gonna call it the Vulture:

Vulture #1

Vulture #2

Vulture #3

well thats it folks!! my first comtribution and hopefully not my last...let me know what you think of her

We were liberated from the fold, that's all, and the world looks the same. And history isn't changed, we're all just part of the game.

Edited by - parabolix on 9/21/2005 7:33:49 PM

Very nice for a first try, it definately has a birdlike feel to it

To improve it a bit and get it closer to a professional standard, I'd start with a few basic steps. Note that I'm not going to ask for something ridiculous, like a cockpit with modeled interior for your very first effort here, these are just some minor things:

1. Learn how to use Subdivision Smoothing, and smooth out the cockpit and other really obviously-faceted areas. Do it carefully, so that you're not wasting polygons, of course, but it will help get your model looking a bit less like it's a folded paper object and more like a spacecraft. That said... until you're a little more advanced, be very, very careful about adding polygons to your model through automation- it's very easy to go well above the best polycounts for gaming (5000 or less, and preferably under 2500), and most newbie modelers fall into the trap of making things more detailed than they should, instead of learning how to use skinning to make the geometry come to life.

2. Before spending a lot more time learning how to model, take the time to read and go through the steps in my Tutorial, "how to skin". Learning how to skin at the same time as learning how to model will make you better at both things, and will teach you good contstruction techniques early on

thx i'll check that out...now i just have to find that smooth button...lol

We were liberated from the fold, that's all, and the world looks the same. And history isn't changed, we're all just part of the game.

argh, question...for 2 vertices to weld...do they simply have to both occupy the same map co-ordinate, or is the something special you have to do to join them? thanks in advance

We were liberated from the fold, that's all, and the world looks the same. And history isn't changed, we're all just part of the game.

in my experience i have always found modelling each bit as a seperate part then joining the whole ship together makes modelling easier, it may depend on what package you use and what techniques you model by but for me the part by part modelling technique works well, also this helps me in my skinning, the parts are already broken down ready to be split and mapped, trem0r, your model is a good start for modeeling, in my view you could have done with seperating the model up more, the cockpit for instance could be a seperate model to the main body, the wings could have been modelled on their own as could the tail and engine, maybe its me but i see a lot of models being made from one primative with vertex streched about to make a shape, im my experience this always causes problems when it comes to skinning and mapping the textures correctly, and as argh correctly said, remember the skin can make or break a model, i have always tried to come up with low poly ships and untill my last few i was keeping them under 1000 but they looked good becuase of the skin,

@Tremor:

Generally speaking, 3D software will weld things per whatever default weld angles you've specified, plus you can select a given pair of verts and then tell it to weld.

Moving verts next to each other or joining them will not necessarily cause them to weld. Joining them, in a package like Max (which, by default, assumes that you want to weld verts) will cause them to weld, but in packages like MS3D, it won't, unless you tell it to. I model with Rhino3D, which generally assumes that you want to weld verts. I unweld everything, and then re-weld things selectively, using different angle settings, until I get things right. Welding flaws are one of the big differences between a "pro" quality game model and amateur attempts. Welding can greatly enhance the sense of curvature in low-poly models, but used incorrectly it introduces horrible-looking rendering artifacts, so you have to be careful.

Edited by - Argh on 9/21/2005 1:38:59 AM

thx guys, all input appreciated...i found the weld fuctions, however, it seems in my particular case im not getting the desired effect even after the welding. ok heres the scenario...with the cockpit, i extruded and beveled 2 seperate faces to get it...yea, i could have done that another way...i realize that now lol, but, i tried to bring the bevel space between the 2 vertices together to give you a continuos effect accross the length of the cockpit...and the 2 vertices that brought it together, i welded. after which, i tried to use the smooth fuction and got the resulting photo...does the weld carry a different value when smoothing? applying a smooth value counting the weld as 2 vertices as opposed to 1? anyway, heres the photo to illustrate wat im saying

Fighter Image

We were liberated from the fold, that's all, and the world looks the same. And history isn't changed, we're all just part of the game.

Edited by - parabolix on 9/21/2005 7:31:19 PM

Please people...if you are using large images post links to them and not the images themselves...I've already had to go through this entire thread changing images to links and it can be quite a hassle...Please just use the link code (if you need help, press the Forum Codes button in the post screen) if you are posting large pictures or multiple pictures.

Changed your images to links...

Edited by - parabolix on 9/21/2005 7:35:45 PM

@Tremor:

Well, if you look at your model before you applied a smoothing step, it's no big surprise that you ended up with that "negative hump" at the join between the cockpit area and the body.

Look at that shot you did from the top, and you will see the problem right away (at least if you're me)... basically, your model wasn't perfectly symmetrical on the right and left sides, and there's a very noticable difference in the area that was mis-interpreted by Max.

Smoothing can introduce problems like that when the software tries to interpret what you've already modeled, and sometimes you have to play around with its angle settings, etc., to get it to do what you want. In this case, assuming that you've saved it like that... well, you're going to need to move the verts up a pair at a time. Sometimes there's just no avoiding having to push-pull verts around, when you model that way. Next time, take great care to keep the model's symmetry absolutely perfect. It's a pain in the rear, but it's well worth it in the end.

Edited by - Argh on 9/22/2005 1:56:34 AM

@Argh
It's been a while since I posted here. I've been keeping up with the posts though. I just wanted to let you know I really like what you did with the "Bandit". You inspired me to learn to texture better so I've been working with Photoshop 7 trying to learn the ins and outs. It's a bit different that PSP but I think I got it down now. I plan on retexturing all my ships (including the couple new ones I got) but still don't get the whole vert welding thing. Every time I try to do it my model gets all screwed up. Maybe you could help out with a couple tips. I primarily use 3DSMax and export to MS3D. I do the texturing in MS3D for the game but can do it much better in 3DSMax. The only problem is getting the 3DSMAX textures into Freelancer. Maybe I'm missing a plugin or something. Anyway, any help would be greatly appreciated.
---PEACE---