yes well then you have the problem of having TOO many servers, EVE has ONE server and they regularly have 20k people on at a time. The only reason WoW has so many people playing it is because its already an established franchise, EVE is doing quite well for a game with no past support that came out of the blue and has quite a few players though i don't know the number off the top of my head. Oh and just to let the WoW fanboys know, anybody who disses guildwars disses blizzard as there are quite a few former blizzard employees that helped make the game so yea...think before you speak please...And what is it with people and this level obsession geez, in EVE there are SKILLS to train, much more realistic, oh yay i'm going to go and kill such and such low level moster repeatedly and somehow unlock soem cool new move or advance to the next level even though its pathetically easy and no challenge whatsoever to my character yet he's still somehow improving doing the sam thing over and over again....yea real logical line of thought there...and well blizzards kinda pathetic as it doesn't really take that much talent to create a premade fantasy universe does it? elves? already had em. Orcs? got em too, alittle different but still got em. Dwarves and all those other miniscule and strange races? somebody else(most likely tolkein) probably made em first. Tauren? wow they ACTUALLY came up with something halfway ORIGINAL, but then again of course its original because its based of a *expletive here* COW! geez how lame can you get? oh and we already had the undead, the evil empire will rule all by turning the lights best fighter against them(geez even Lucas and starwars beat them to that one so come on)


Ok so lets take a look at EVE and Guildwars. EVE: sci-fi game set in ORIGINAL and freshly CREATIVE and NEW setting. Good gameplay? check. great skill system? HE-doublehockey sticks yes! Fun? you better believe it. alot of players? duh. Comprehensive ingame support for corporations(equivalent of clans)? well gee i dunno do you think those giant corps taking over a quarter of the universe by force and fighting other smalelr corps all the way have something to do with it?


Guildwars, original universe? damn straight it is. Good gameplay? what else would it be. Fun player vs player competitions? got that too and no waiting lines or split servers so you and all yoru friends are all together!! imagine that!! good skills/experience system compared to WoW? well lets see, level is cut off at 20 evening the playing field for the newer palyers so they don't have to pwrlvl for a month to be on par with other players and we can't forget about all those nicely balanced skills that the devs have spent long nights on to get just right. oh and we can't forget the frequent COMPREHENSIVE streaming patches both EVE and guildwars have. There, now i have to go to bed, now next time you WoW fanboys come along to try and prove your game is "best" lpease take a look around first, i just described two games that completely annihilate the fun factor of WoW once ou take away the fancy elves, dwarves, undead etc. heck i've played free korean MMO's that are more interesting than WoW. so yea, now i'm going to be told to get a life and recieve nicely worded and sophisticated sounding replys to counter my statements that are supposed to 'blow me away' on sight. so yea, i'm out its late and i'm tired as it took my CPT's this morning so sayonara.

very nice argumetns, dragon This topic might prove interesting afterall

Can't speak for GW, but I have to agree on EVE. Didn't like the recent drone mission nerf but PvP is getting a bit more fun.

Did I not say that I didn't want to argue this?

Dragon, try some spelling and grammar checks. As I know I've stated somewhere on this site before, trying to compare EVE and WoW is like comparing Metal Gear Solid with F Zero GX. When I said that EVE is a mediocre game and WoW is perfect in nearly every way, I didn't say that WoW was better than EVE. It just depends on what style of game you want. I like the scifi theme, but I've tried EVE and I thought it sucked. I agree that the fantasy genre has been done to death, but that's not a bad thing when it's actually done right. Think World War II FPSs, there are thousands of them, but only a few good ones. And those good ones like Call of Duty 2 have players that don't care that the game is set in a tired genre, if it's a good game, it doesn't matter where it's set. Hell, I never really liked the fantasy genre too much, I was usually more of a scifi guy, but seeing as WoW is a good fantasy game, and (IMO) EVE sucks, I'd rather play WoW. I've also tried Guild Wars, and it's good, but again, I'd rather play WoW. Fifteen dollars a month is not a lot of money, and when I can have WoW over GW, I say it's worth it.

So what if WoW isn't realistic? Of course they didn't have blimps (called Zepplins in the game) in the middle ages. Of course they didn't have guns then. But it's in the game, it makes it more intresting, and above all, it works. If WoW tried to be realistic, it would be boring as hell. The only race you could play as would be humans (you could choose between the Germans or the French.) You'd probably be in Black Plague stricken Europe. It would take you days to get to another major city. You wouldn't be able to have cool pets to help you fight like raptors and swoops. Undertaking would be the most popular profession as all the player's characters would die from the Black Plague. It would take weeks to take a ship and go to another continent (unlike WoW where it just takes minutes.)

If every race in World of Warcraft were completly made up, then it would just feel silly. People love the fantasy genre, and with the fantasy genre they expect creatures like dwarves, elves, some kind of minitors (like the Tauren) etc. If every race were original, then it would be like playing as a bunch of aliens in the Middle Ages.

In WoW, you either ride or run around on foot and fight using ranged attacks or melee combat. In EVE, you fly around in space ships and shoot at each other with high-tech weapons. That right there should be enough to tell you that EVE and WoW can't really be compaired as to which is better. They're just too different. Because I like WoW and don't like EVE doesn't make it better than EVE, it just means I'd rather play WoW.

But it's five-thirty in the morning here, I'm tired and I just got on and posted this because I was bored and couldn't sleep. Anyway, can we please drop this EVE vs WoW thing? Let it go. You can't say one is better than the other unless they are even remotely similar. It's annoying, and it will accomplish nothing.

Oooh! Fight! Fight! Fight!

* The Evil Thing is slapped by Killa

Aaanyway, Killa has a point. Comparing EVE and WoW is like comparing triflic acid and semtex. Both are kind of fun, but ultimately it's personal opinion. I happen to prefer MMOs where you can do a lot more than powerlevel to 60 then spend 2 years getting a full epic set (cheap shot) but hey, it's your life.

Being an avid WoW fan, i will be the first to admit it as MAJOR flaws.

The first one is in the name. World and WARcraft. No war happens in the world. At all. The only things that happen is ganking of lowbies. You want PvP? You que up in a BG for 2hours only to find your team of 15 fighting 2 oppenents.

Next, is its PvP ranking system is the most shambolic of PvP systems ever. You actually need to spend upwards of 15 hours a day week in, week out, to get to what is Rank 14. This is a lifestealing feat.

On the list now is its PvE. Thats all WoW is. PvE. The constant grind for epics, the people that grind hours in high end instances then going into BG's to pwn all the freshbie 60's.

Next is its terrible customer support. Never have i seen it so bad.

Class blanace is something that doesn't exist. Its been given the nickname World Of Castercraft. Make of that what you will.

However, the plus sides are from 1-59 its a great game. A majority of quests lack any real meaning and most are "Kill 20 of these" "Kill 20 of these and bring their hearts" "Deliver this message to xxxx in xxxxx"

There are some good quests alliance side (don't know about horde side) that involve breaking a man out of prison and walking with him to Stormwind Keep for a showdown with a boss.

The other plus is there are a lot of great people playing it. This is what has made me stay in the game. My guild is multinational and speaking with them makes me want to stay and play the game more.


With all this said, i will leave WoW. That day will come when Star Trek online is released and when the Warhammer MMO comes out.

Now bret, I agree with some of what you've said. I haven't had to use CS, so I don't really know what it's like. I agree that some of the quests are stupid, but hey, at least at the lower levels it gives good exp and sometimes valuble loot.

When you're a newbie to WoW like me (not n00b) those "deliver xxx to xxx in xxx" quests give a little extra exp when you're just discovering someplace new. The only PvP I've had in WoW was the occasional duel, I'm not yet high enough to do the BG. Hell, my highest character is a level 14 Tauren hunter, and then I have a level 5 Gnome warlock.

From what I've seen, Shamen is the p00nz0rz class in WoW, while warriors tend to always get their asses kicked by hunters, druids and shamen. Basically, a melee fighter will always lose to one that can use magic or poison.

And bret, stay far far away from Star Trek, that evil will destroy your mind, just as Runescape once did to me.

ok i'll drop the EVE vs WoW topic for awhile, but guildwars i will bot. Guildwars is a EXTREMELY superior game to anything that WoW could ever be. there is no monthly fee, the game is fun theres, no waiting lines, combat is not based totally on items(it does help to have a good weapon of course but its not everything), everything is on one server, the game us constantly getting streaming patches that only require you to restart the game and only takes a minute maximum on a cable connection. The quests are fun and interesting as well as fresh. The level limit is low and the guild/PvP ladder is excellent as proven by the world championship tourney with cash pizes they had a few months back over in taiwan i think it was which i thin kthey will be doing every year. You are guarunteed new content instead of a monthly fee destroying your pocket book as expansion will come out every six-nine months and you aren't even required to buy them or you can buy them and not the original game and still get a very enjoyable experience out of it. The skills and classes are balanced though some classes would obviously beat others in one on one somply because of the role they play.

As i see it WoW is something for the little kiddies with rich parents that have no life to speak of and are destined to be criminals or delinquents by the age of twenty. The game sucks period, everybody gets alittle tired of the generic elves, humans, dwarves, orcs etc. Tolkein did a very good job and his is whati would consider a true fantasy world, WoW is just some dilapidated and twisted mutation of it that doesn't do it justice and blizzard is only after your money. With guildwars they actually have had devs INGAME answering questions and having fun with the players, heck theres special events on some fo the holdiays such as halloween and christmas that are very well done and the devs are usually there at the events. Here's a link to a page that wil do soem explaining about guildwars aswell, oh and copie sold sin't everything you know.

http://www.gwonline.net/page.php?p=205

if that or this post doesn't convince you your getting scammed by a company only concerned about money then i can't help you and rest my case.

Bret, you sound like a PvPer. Try EVE, it has the best PvP ever, be it economic, military or territorial. It is, after all, a PvP game (a bit like Planetside). There is nothing quite like causing a price crash throughout the region with brutally low mineral sell orders, like watching Uncle BoB's territory slowly creep towards your own while hoping they'll respect the NAP you put up six months ago, like taking down a battlecruiser in a lowly frigate single-handedly.

This is a map of player alliance territory in the EVE world. As far as I know, not even GW has something this complex going on. (By the way, the unclaimed space in the centre is controlled by the NPC factions.)

@TET

I am a PvP'r but the WoW system makes it impossible for me to rank as it requires more time than anything i have ever come across. As for EVE, i tried but to be honest i found the interface very "clunky". It just wasn't clear what i was supposed to be doing.

Perhaps one day i will pick it up again and have another go

@dragonborn

I'm going to disagree with what you said. As i said in my post, WoW has its problems but is not as bad as you make it out to be.

Did you know the makers of GW are ex Blizz employees who left becuase they didn't like what WoW was becoming? Instead Blizz hired some ex EQ devs to make the end game content (hence WoW looks at PvE more than PvP)

I don't think WoW is a kiddies game, sure there are young players, some good, some bad. But 95% of my raiding guild are over 20 and either work, go to college or uni, or are generally just lazy How do i know there ages? Becuase i talk to them on Teamspeak

Fine, I will give EVE another try. Maybe it's changed for the better since I last played it.

EDIT: As I said, I would give EVE another try, and I gotta say... it's making a lousy second impression. It's boring. Sure, warping around is kind of cool, but those sublight engines are so damn slow. Zzzzz. The combat is still unexciting, although it is workable. I suppose that the huge galactic sized environment isn't really anything to be amazed by. Sure, the cosmos look nice and pretty, but when you're inside the systems, it's just so empty. At least, it's better than I remember it. END EDIT

However, as I previously said, I am not going to engage in an arguement on which is better: WoW or GW. I like WoW, but I don't recall ever saying it was better than GW. (If you can find somewhere that I said it then please point it out.) As I also said, EVE and WoW can't really be compaired. You know that feeling that you get when you've just gotten a brand new game that you've been wanting for a while? You know how for a while it seems perfect in every way? Well, at least for me, that's gone now. I agree with Bret, WoW does have some problems but what game doesn't? At least on some of the servers I've played, the players on the Alliance side are idiots, and mostly everyone on Horde is nice.

However, I'm not going to continiue debating over GW and WoW. I'll keep coming back to this thread, but I'm not planning on engaging in any more arguements.

EDIT:

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Did you know the makers of GW are ex Blizz employees who left becuase they didn't like what WoW was becoming? Instead Blizz hired some ex EQ devs to make the end game content (hence WoW looks at PvE more than PvP)

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Hum, I didn't know that. Thanks for bringing that to my attention. I've never been a good PvPer, I've always pretty much stuck with PvE, something which WoW has when you're just not trying to grind to be the first level 60 on a new server. And the unstability? The excellent/horrible community is the price you pay for having almost six million players.

Edited by - Killa on 7/1/2006 6:04:41 PM

Edited by - Killa on 7/2/2006 10:00:48 AM

Can I take it the game you were leaving for, wasn't that good after all?

Killa, if you're a PvE-er, you won't like EVE

People who take drugs are bad.

Damn customs agents

actually i did know that there were alot of former blizzard employees that developed the game. WHY do you think they left? well i'll just let you figure that otu on your own since i don't feel like explaining it when it'll just get thrown right back in my face. EVE takes awhile to get to the fun stuff, not as long as WoW but a few days or so, if you don't know how to play the game then yes it is boring but it can be very rewarding and fun to play once you figure it out, especially once you join a corp.