Even if the country only caused you grief and treats you badly?
Or do stuff that is totally unacceptable or against your own moral values?

Yep, because you are going on the strength that your judgement is better than you nations. Whilst you can argue about how for some countries this is definately true, and we can be glad that others have done it, in return you are not the judge and jury of a nation - and therefore cannot be deemed to make decisions that affect the nation or state. Simply put - how is your judgement so sound over everyone elses? Whilst there are situations that are contrary to what i say, the flip side is that many many more deem that their countries aer wrong etc, which is simply because they are misguided. Are you saying that if Osama disagreed with his countries methods, that he should then be able to sell nuclear information to nations that would develop it just because he thinks he is right? - or that every criminal who gets locked up (therfore being treated badly by his government) should have a green light to be treasonous to their nation??

Looking from an idealogical point of view, everyone who would do this would be a citizen of the world, who acted in methods to PREVENT terrible things from occuring, but to every side their is so much MORE than the simple black and white that we are blessed with being able to look at the world. We will make judgements on others actions with only what we know/have been potrayed. But if someone like Osama was in charge of a nuclear weapons testing (ie - nutter), would you really support the fact that he disagreed with his country that he sold said weaponry to north Korea, or Libya? Methinks not.

Simply put - the world we look at through our eyes is simple and easy to see. The world looked by nations leaders is complex and full of potholes and pitfalls - where they will be damned if they do/damned if they don't

Trust that the country/nation as a whole is good, because 95% would do a treasonous thing for all the WRONG reasons!! Although there are nations who have corrupt governments who would wish for global domination, the amount of people who would be selfish enough to follow their own beliefs/desires FAR outweighs the leaders of the world.

Edited by - Chips on 7/24/2004 4:43:05 AM

What if such a guy presents his project (or product) to the govt for financing and he's denied it? Any reaonable person would sell the stuff to those who pay. BTW, a similar thing happened in my country - dunno if he actually sold his idea anywhere (it was about secret state border surveilance cameras aimed at identifying people traficking illegal immigrants), and I've heard a lot of similar stories happened in Russia right after the breakdown of the USSR.
Personally, I believe that your own state should be given a priority. If that doesn't work - well, it's free market, you gave your govt a chance, so it's not treason anymore. A different situation is if you were working on some govt project and started sellin info to other interested parties (as, according to rumors, happened to the US nuclear weapon sold to Russians by a couple of Jews).

Wisdom comes with age. But sometimes age comes alone...

Depends, as now the "govt refused financing" could actually be blackmail. As said, in some cases its all above board, but in most its not.
Also - are the selling it to someone that they know maybe buying it to cause death or destruction to their own country?
Are they selling it with intent that it be used to cause harm to their own country etc etc.

Edited by - Chips on 7/24/2004 8:32:32 AM

I think nowadays nobody cares - a long as you get the right amount of cash, that is.

Wisdom comes with age. But sometimes age comes alone...

There is no loyalty to the nation state anymore, the world is made up soley of corporations and greed. Governments are just organizations now, no different than GE or Microsoft. They demand nuclear knowledge, and the freemarket is happy to oblige with scientists selling the stuff. So long as it wasn't confidential stuff (at which point he's breaking a freemarket agreement with the government, a bit like a copyright or trademark), any info he gains is his to sell to whoever he wishes. --- VH16

Freemarket ain't so great, is it?

I am Nobody; Nobody is Perfect; Therefore, I am Perfect

If we are talking about weapons, weapons systems, anti-weapons systems or detection systems, if you have the secret and sell it to someone other than your own government, you're most likely subject to treatment as if you did commit an act of treason.

If we are talking about the cure for cancer or something like that and you sell your rights to it to some other government, your an idiot first, an opportunist second and perhaps a traitor last.

More techinicalitys of it; The Constitution Artical III - Section 3. Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort. No person shall be convicted of treason unless on the testimony of two witnesses to the same overt act, or on confession in open court.

Which does give a little more leway.

Giving away information that your country deems important to keep secret, even if you made it up, is treason.

Let's get those missiles ready to destroy the universe!!

But then again, is it really right to keep such massive weapons in the hands of countries that allready over power us all? Give Brazil a nuke, and the issues they bring up as defender of the third world would get a lot more attention. Give African nations nukes, and all of a sudden we'd want to mitigate their genocides a whole lot more. The only nations we care about (Russia, N. Korea, Pakistan, Iraq) either have nukes or are getting nukes (well, arguably Iraq). The other countries of the world have real problems too, I say give them the bomb to act as an equilizer. Death to the superpower, all hail the rise of the new world order, one where we actually care about smaller nations! --- VH16

I am Nobody; Nobody is Perfect; Therefore, I am Perfect

"treason never prospers; and here's the reason, for if it prospers, it isn't treason..."