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Clean Sweep

The general place to discuss MOD''ing Freelancer!

Post Sun Sep 25, 2005 1:36 pm

Clean Sweep

I was wondering if it was possible (and if is, please tell how) to remove all the factions, ships, equipment, ect., but still have Freelancer run. I wanted to know this, because I would like a “blank template” of Freelancer for my mod, so it would be easier to create and test the new items. Now I know there has to be at least one of each item for Freelancer to run, but I tried to remove all the items of the game, except one of each, and it wouldn’t even get to the main screen. Any help would be nice.

Everything is nothing, but nothing is not everything.

Post Sun Sep 25, 2005 1:39 pm

yeah im probolly the best one here at doing that, ive done it about 8 times before ^^

want me to make you one for you?

Post Sun Sep 25, 2005 2:09 pm

Argh's revolutionary new OpenSP has the potential of removing everything save about 5% of the code.

Course, we're still waiting on that

Post Sun Sep 25, 2005 3:48 pm

@Trail
What make the files, sure. Just tell me how to get them after you do it.

@Blackhole2001
Argh's OpenSP is only for missions, and I'm allready using it.

Everything is nothing, but nothing is not everything.

Post Sun Sep 25, 2005 4:46 pm

Alfa ,BH doesn't mean the one Argh put up for download, he's taking about a new concept Argh's come up with, but the files aren't editable with FLMM. I also have a small OpenSP mod that's based on Argh's idea, and I'm currentlly testing it. So far its very promising Just think OSP in a mod thats between 10-15kb in size, and TC's that can finally get rid of the mission files and every other reference to the vanilla systems.

Rebalance 3.5 Dev. Team
rebalance.blue-ion.net

Post Sun Sep 25, 2005 5:02 pm

1) What do you mean, There not working with FLMM?
2) All I want is the straight .ini's.
3) How does yours work?

Everything is nothing, but nothing is not everything.

Edited by - alfa_astrix on 9/25/2005 6:04:18 PM

Post Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:01 pm

Um... well, basically, you need to get rid of a lot of things in order to have a "blank" FL. Anything that references anything else needs to have been removed, where possible, and that's a very long chain of items.

If done properly, you should end up with a "reverse SDK", where 95% of the INIs are blanks, or contain just a few entries, and FLMM would essentially replace just about everything with blanks, which should shorten load times for TCs to a very small fraction, as well as providing super-efficient execution- you'd get to see how well FL can run with very little "stuff" to eat up RAM and slow down its internal parser/search/execute routines.

This is on my list of projects, but I have other fish to fry first- I will be coming back to this at some point, though. I would like to see this get built about as much as anybody, but I have to prioritize my time spent on modding, and getting the next version of the Toolkit released is my highest priority right now, followed by several other things before I get to this. If Bejaymac or others are interested in pursuing this goal... basically, here's some concrete advise on how to build this:

1. I would use Alternative OpenSP as a starting-place, but have it point to a new System, that features exactly ONE Mbase entry.

2. Gut everything having to do with Systems, Bases, Solars, Universe, Equipment, Shiparch, etc., etc. etc. Blank them all out.

3. Building from start, create one System. It needs to have a Light, a Dockable object that docks with a Base, and that's it. You could be nice and include a Zone or three and a Nebula and a Field, so that there is "one of everything" in the mod.

4. Building from start, create a Ship. This includes an Engine, a Thruster, a Shield, a Weapon, a Powerplant, a Light, etc. This will also require entries into market_ships, goods, etc. to complete correctly.

5. Build a single AI, a Faction, and assign a Loadout, npcship, etc. to the Faction, so that it can spawn the Ship and fly it around.

... and that's pretty much all there is to it. I'm making it sound easy but actually executing this will be a pain, and rather time-consuming. It's not something you want to try if you aren't thoroughly experienced and understand what INIs refer to other INIs... because for this sort've project, neither FLSpew nor FLScan are likely to help you get things fixed if you screw up.

If I were wanting to try this, I would start with the XML Toolkit Mod laid on top of the SDK 1.5, and then go from there. Why start with the Toolkit? Because:

A. It already has complete Shiparch/Npcships/Loadout stuff already implemented in XML/FLMM format, so you can skip that part.

B. It already has the AI files almost completely gutted, and the AIs that are in there are "complete", so that it's obvious what you need to do there- just delete all but one.

Basically, you're going to spend a lot've time blanking out all of the INIs, and then you're going to need to painstakingly build up everything, one step at a time, until you have a complete, working game.

Using workarounds via Alternative OpenSP is a easy alternative... but it's not really a complete solution, nor does it avoid potential conflicts and errors. Which is why I think that it will be in everybody who wants to work on TC mods of various kinds interests to get something like this built, so that coders can start with a "clean slate".

Edited by - Argh on 9/26/2005 1:34:56 AM

Post Mon Sep 26, 2005 1:37 am

a fresh start with only 1 DLL, neat, im workin on i but i dont actually have any time at the moment

Post Mon Sep 26, 2005 9:26 am

@ alfa, the files I was talking about are the newplayer.fl in the exe folder and the restart.fl in your mods save folder. Properly editted these remove the storyline completely, mods like Crossfire (sry OP ) will nolonger get slagged for not testing their mods in SP as there is no SP with this. But because FLMM doesn't edit them there are no options like starting place, so players have to take their chances with where ever the mod maker puts them. This also means that because no 2 mods are exactly the same my files will work on vanilla and most small mods, any mod that has new factions, or altered/deleted vanilla ships & equipment will have to make their own.

@ Argh, like you I've got way to much happening, between RL and PC problems (damned moniter) I'm about 3 weeks behind with Rebalance, to make matters worse, the past 2 nights I've been helping others with their mods (granted -Trail-'s only took 20 minutes to fix ).

Rebalance 3.5 Dev. Team
rebalance.blue-ion.net

Post Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:06 pm

@Bejaymac
Sorry, but what I meant is what Argh was talking about, and removing all but what is needed for to run the game.

@Anyone
I’m sorry about this, there wouldn’t be any chance that someone could do this for me? I’ve got a huge school project right now, and don’t have much time to work on this. I’m only able to post this since I have a few minutes to rest before my “slave driving” grandmother makes me get back to work. If anyone could, I would be very appreciative.

Everything is nothing, but nothing is not everything.

Post Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:36 pm

I'm sure that it will get done at some point. Be patient. We're not talking just a few minutes work here- doing this right will take days.

Post Mon Sep 26, 2005 3:47 pm

@Alfa
Thats what i was talking about. You were talking about doing a "Clean Sweep". I said that Argh's new restart.fl/newplayer.fl OpenSP method (not availible for DL yet) would help ENORMOUSLY becuase it doesn't just bypass it, it REMOVES the storyline completely, thus stopping freelancer from referencing dozens of INI files because of the 1st mission.

Hmmm, maybe i'll work on that in my spare time.......maybe

Edited by - Blackhole2001 on 9/26/2005 5:10:12 PM

Post Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:39 pm

Actually, Alternative OpenSP also removes all of those INI references, and works just as well. The only major advantage to restart.fl is that you can play around with certain things, like Faction alliances, that normally can only be done with MP-only mods...

At any rate... yes, that was the first step in this direction. The next step is to gut Mbases, and the various Universe files. Then remove all Factions, except for one, all Loadouts except for one, dump the Effects except for the minimum needed for the ship's Engine, the Weapon, etc., the Sounds (replace all defaults with nulls so that even if they get loaded, they eat up hardly any memory), etc., etc., etc.

A lot of work... to do this right. But the results should be well worth it, for any serious TC. Before I go back to work on WOS B2, I'll get this done. I need to finish my current slate of projects first, though:

1. Finish the 1001 coding changes needed for the next version of the XML Toolkit, still only about 90% coded.

2. Skin / Code / Deploy two ship models graciously given to my care by ImperraTodd.

3. Finish some optimization work for Free Worlds.

Three projects... that will take awhile. I do not have unlimited free time, and I have to sleep... and for the last three weeks, I've had exactly ONE day off from work

Post Tue Sep 27, 2005 1:02 am

Sorry I can't help. My projects due Wednesday, so after that, If I follow your instructions right, I should be able to work on it. (Damn, giving up good sleep just to post this)

Everything is nothing, but nothing is not everything.

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