Try the boron trade between California and Manchester.

One cannot run from the pirates forever and getting the Lane Hackers/Liberty Rouges/Outcasts to like you is a good start. Besides, the Dromedary at Mactan Base hauls more cargo than the Humpback.

this is my trade run, enormously long, and takes longer, but 1.5 mil strike a bell? thats the profits for one complete run. here's it.
detroit munitions (light arms) > planet crete ($1190 profit per unit) buy oxygen > cadiz base ($35 profit per unit) buy artifacts> planet new berlin ($887 prifut per unit)buy mining machinery > freiburg station ($30 profit per unit) buy diamonds>planet new tokyo ($1342 profit per unit) buy consumer goods > planet honshu ($67 profit per unit) buy optronics > planet cambrigde ($1189 profit per unit)buy luxury food (perished 8-10)>planet manhattan ($1040 profit per unit) > buy H-fuel > detroit munitions ($29 profit per unit)
* the ones with low profit are just to get to places with lower prices for bigger profit on later steps... but its really long, and get a dromedary or humpback, it really pays.

presently, my world is upside down, so if u do not mind, u'll have to tok to my a$$

Hi folks,

I take it there have been plenty of other Trade message threads? Oh well, here's my two cents.

I don't see any of you talking about "rates". If you're into the scenery, fine, but distance is a critical component if you're talking about making the most money per unit time.

Easy to say, harder to measure. One simple way to do it is to consider each trade lane or system jump, as a unit of time. It's not quite that simple, since trade lanes are not all the same length nor the distance from end of trade lanes to jumpgates or stations. But anyway, it's a start.

A simple starter run, is a NY loop from BB Missouri (H fuel 389-336=53) to West Point (Water 24-20=4), exactly one trade lane, $57 RT (roundtrip). 57/2 trade lanes RT = $28.5 per unit time.

Let's compare jworley's Houston engines (974-600=374) <-> LA polymers (480-330=150). RT profit 524, but as I count it, 8 time units one way (6 lanes, 2 jumps), 16 RT. 524/16=$32.75 per unit time.

The numbers are not real far apart, although of course jw's gets the nod in this simple analysis. In reality a stopwatch could shed some real light since the '1 trade lane' and the '8 time units' are rough measures.

A big difference between the two for somebody totally fresh off the boat, though, is that the shorter NY run lets one compound much faster. This is critical in the early stages. Looking a little more closely, jw's route is only 15% better than the little BM<->WP loop superficially (32.75/28.5). But compare that the little loop lets one increase their cash by 16% every two units of time (57/356/2, profit / buy costs / time), whereas jw's only does 3.5% (524/930/16). Or in other words, jw's does better at the point when your freighter is maxxed and carrying a full load, but the little NY loop lets you build up much, much faster.

In re: Copperhead, boron from LA (167) to Manchester Sheffield (600) is $433 but 7 time units (5 lanes, 2 jumps) for 14 RT; 433/14=$31 per unit time. A little less than jw's route; certainly stopwatch material. If I am reading Darren Malphurs' Freelance Cargo Computer utuility right, Copperhead could bring polymers back from Sheffield to LA, adding 145 (330-185) to the RT; this makes it 578/16=$41 per unit time, clearly real good. However, you still wouldn't want to do it when brand new due to the long time period involved.

Another real plus to the little NY loop for brand newbies is the total lack of cruise disruption in NY (unless you po the cops). Sell all your weapons and even your b+bs in order to compound your money early... if you're jumped, just hit shift-W and cruise to the next Lane gate past the one right in front of you. Popcorn is an excellent additive at this point.

That's right, sell almost everything. Compounding LOVES every ounce of early cash.

Here's what I do as a newbie: 1) sell everything but shield and thruster (all weps, flares, mines, b+bs... everything but shield and thruster), 2) do the NY loop; cruise if jumped, 3) when at approx. $16k (with all inventory sold), get a Rhino (this lets me get Rhino plus 20 H fuels; in other words, no "down time" when shifting to Rhino), 3) continue NY loop until the Rhino is full AND you've stocked up on bots+batts and a full complement of flares and cheap mines; you might need it soon, 4) fill your hold with Boron from Pittsburgh (it's relatively cheap AND cRaZy money, so you don't lose your shirt plus you make tons if you live through the next step, which anybody who can run well should), 5) Go to LD14 in Leeds and sell your $120 boron for $960, 6) Get a Clydesdale at Leeds with your huge leap in monies, and outfit your ship a little better, but still BUY NO WEPS per se... just update shield, b+b, flares and mines. 7) Start the run with Niobium from Tau31's Holman (320) to Leeds' Stokes (640; 320 profit), and on return trip take Pharms from Glasgow (255) to Holman (400; 145 profit). Yes, the Pharm prices are a little better from Leeds itself or to Harris, but not when divided by time. RT of Holman/Stokes/Glasgow is 465 with 7 time units (2 lanes plus 1 jump each way, plus 1 for Glasgow), = $66/time. A Humpie is available at Harris for approx. 160k; get it as soon as you can afford it PLUS your next load or two. (Be careful not to have your entire liquid cash in your hold because if you get fried, your ass is in a sling. The pirates Know. Trust me.)

The Holman/Stokes run has the extreme advantage of doubling your money each run (until, of course, your hold is full). It's also pretty damn safe once you have a Clydesdale... Tau31 is quieter than Leeds, odd as it seems.

Using the above, I was level 7 at 2 hours online (F8), then leapt to 14 when I hit LD14 and was level 18 at the end of 3 hours, soon to get a Humpie. When I signed off 3 hours and 40 minutes after first setting foot on the server, I was level 25. Anyone who's done better, let us know!

For what it's worth, I've been trying to find exact coords of where stations, jump gates/holes, and even start/stops for trade lanes are, so I can massage the commodity data I have into a "dollar per unit time" function. If anybody has exact coords on all that stuff, please let me know. Don't tell me how to get it myself, just tell me if somebody else has made it all, already

Keep on trucking,

CAPT Hyberniu T. Rex
aka Dr. Mike in Atlanta

hmm i like this particuliar run coz its the shortest i usually took.
Texaslanet Houston
VIA
Bering: Freeport 2

i cant remember the details ya hava check it out but i think its light arms or engine conpo in houson & something simple on the way back.
the thingy here is that for a minimium of $200 per unit for a full loop, u only need to take 2 lanes & a jump to complete.
so its short & sweet & ya prolly go mad doing god knows how many tos & fros in an hour.
P.S. i usu strap myself to a discman doing this.

CAPT HTR wrote:
"In re: Copperhead, boron from LA (167) to Manchester Sheffield (600) is $433 but 7 time units (5 lanes, 2 jumps) for 14 RT; 433/14=$31 per unit time."

You don't fly back empty.....

It's only 4 lanes (and takes 5min30secs) 433/6 = $72
Return with Polymers: Buy 185, sell 330 -> 145/6 = $24
(72+24)/2 = $48
or:
(433+145)/12 = $48 per unit time.


CAPT HTR also wrote:
"Using the above, I was level 7 at 2 hours online (F8), then leapt to 14 when I hit LD14 and was level 18 at the end of 3 hours, soon to get a Humpie. When I signed off 3 hours and 40 minutes after first setting foot on the server, I was level 25. Anyone who's done better, let us know!"

Level 28 in 1 hour 30 minutes

00:10 Wreck a couple of police Storage Depots @ Manhattan, to get just under "Kill on sight" with Rougues.
**** Lane Hackers, Outcasts, Xenos are now just under "Kill on sight" too ****
Sell weps/bots/bats
Boron: Pittsburg -> Sheffield Stattion
Polymers: Sheffield Stattion -> LA
Buy Rhino
Boron: LA -> Sheffield Stattion
Polymers: Sheffield Stattion -> LA
Boron: LA -> Sheffield Stattion
Polymers: Sheffield Stattion
Dromedary+Weapons+Gold: Mactan base -> LA
Boron: LA -> Sheffield Stattion
**** In New London system expect problems with Mollys & Corsairs ****
Light Weapons: Sheffield Stattion -> Planet New London
Luxury food: Planet New London -> LA

Done. Level 28


Edited by - Jaabaa on 06-04-2003 01:45:32

Edited by - Jaabaa on 06-04-2003 01:57:35

the shortest trade route I can think of is in Norfolk


dock with Battleship Missori (sp) load up on H-fuel, undock and dock with Norfolk shipyear right next door!

the profit is about $20 per unit

and there's NO danger what so ever!

lol just do that a few thousand times and you're rich!

the houston - LA trade route is ok. It yields 3x the money per time unit than the best trade route in NY. But I wouldn't take the jump hole. It's faster to use the trade lanes because the jump holes are so far away ...

The best trade route I found so far is 3 Mio/hour (in a dromedary). Compare your trade routes to this value and you know if it is a good one

My favourite:

Small arms from Detriot Monition to Malta (buy 140, sell 1400); then cardamine from Malta to Manhatten (buy 300, sell 1500); then consumer goods from Manhatten back to Detroit Monition (buy 66, sell 72). If you are friendly with the Outcasts and Bounty Hunters, and is smart enough to use the jump holes instead of the patrolled jump gates, you will fly the whole route virtually unopposed except for an odd Xanos or two.

-----------------------------------------------------------
War does not decide who is right, only who is left.

Thanks Jaabaa! I will definitely try that. Also some of the other good routes posted here.

Can someone tell me, will the Police (or anybody else) start attacking me if I take out their Depots? And/or should I do it when there aren't certain types of ships patrolling nearby?

Also, what happens if I get scanned when I have cardamine? Will I get shot or get "kill" faction? Or cargo confiscated? I've never tried it before.

Bleh... one more question... it looks like somebody already took out the Depots in Manhattan... I can't find any, anywhere in NY... any ideas?

TIA!! -- Hyberniu

Edited by - CAPT HTR on 06-04-2003 20:45:24

Edited by - CAPT HTR on 06-04-2003 21:10:54

Yeah, I'm KOS to the whole Liberty Police force now, can't go anywhere in any of the Liberty systems w/o getting jumped. Of course, I'm lvl 32 and there isn't much they can do about it...

"Can someone tell me, will the Police (or anybody else) start attacking me if I take out their Depots? And/or should I do it when there aren't certain types of ships patrolling nearby?"

He he, of course they will, and they do, "in swarms". Just die & respawn like a man. ( wimp )
Your police/navy rep goes down just the same if you respawn.

"Also, what happens if I get scanned when I have cardamine? Will I get shot or get "kill" faction? Or cargo confiscated? I've never tried it before."

It's just like being jumped, "Drop your cargo or else", well, then you drop it, and hit "B" to tractor it in again, the cops/navy don't pick it up

"Bleh... one more question... it looks like somebody already took out the Depots in Manhattan... I can't find any, anywhere in NY... any ideas?"

Really? There should be 3 in the direction of detroit, one of which is from DSE if I remember rightly. There are also another 2 (3?) at Fort Bush, but I don't know who they belong to.

It worked great, Jaabaa! Except I only got level 24... not sure what happened there... but it only took 85 minutes, so it's way better then what I was doing. Selling the boron at 285% profit (600/167) really rockets the money!

Right, I couldn't find any Depots in NY... apparently they had already been shot up. (There *were* three Depots-- but empty of any storage modules.) I wonder if they ever respawn, or if it requires a server restart? Anyway, I got on another server, which had the Depots, and away I went. I had to kill three modules, for what it's worth... a good thing to point out because a person might not have seen Rogues yet and not know their standing and sell their weps and go their merry way, only to find out later that they didn't do enough reputation work.

I did some time calculations... my final route with Holman niobium to Stokes (640-320=320) then Glasgow pharms to Holman (400-255=145) earns 116k RT and takes about 8 minutes RT, for approx 14.5k/minute. This is in the Humpie (250 cargo) that can be picked up in Harris.

Your route of LA boron to Sheffield (600-167=433) then Sheffield polymers to LA (330-185=145) earns 159k RT (in the Dromedary, 275 cargo) and takes about 13 minutes RT. This is approx 12.2k/minute. However, your route has significantly better percent profit (180% overall) vs. mine (81% overall), so yours is way better in the "build" phase (which was the point of my "challenge", of course), although mine would be a little better in a sustained phase (19% better with Humpie, 31% better with Dromedary, in $/minute).

Anyway, thanks for the great trade route. Anybody know any that are better?? Whether for building or sustained. CW and Heymlich, can you put those routes you mention, into $/minute (or hour)? And, how do you do 3M $/hour, dude???

Okeydoke -- HTR

Edited by - CAPT HTR on 07-04-2003 03:41:44

Edited by - CAPT HTR on 07-04-2003 03:45:43

new berlin => new tokyo
diamonds
new tokyo => the ring (new berlin)
niobium

makes about 80 credits per minute and cargo unit.
takes about 27 minutes back and forth.

80*250= 20k/minute (humpback)
80*275= 22k/minute (dromedary)

almost similar is:
roppongi (new tokyo) => ainu depot (hokkaido - c6)
luxury consumer goods
ainu depot (hokkaido - c6) => roppongi (new tokyo)
cardamine

takes only 12 minutes and has about 80 credits per minute&cargo aswell.

these are the best trade routes i know so far, havent found any better, though i was checking almost all trade routes in this forum (well, i didnt actualy fly all of them, but rather checked theoretically if it was *possible* to do the runs in the max time to reach 80 credits per minute)

Edited by - sp00n on 07-04-2003 09:59:52

Quote:

"Also, what happens if I get scanned when I have cardamine? Will I get shot or get "kill" faction? Or cargo confiscated? I've never tried it before.

It's just like being jumped, "Drop your cargo or else", well, then you drop it, and hit "B" to tractor it in again, the cops/navy don't pick it up"

Correct me if I'm wrong, the police won't scan your ship for contraband if you're very friendly with them.