What are you talking about me 'a deep Matrix person'? I have not been able to successfully rebutt you on the Trinity and the bolt thing - Your 'Matrix within Matrix' theory still dominates until this moment and I still cry at night when I couldn't think of a proper rebuttal. Heck you're partly responsible for my insomnia

that's hilarious, FF, because you convinced me i was totally wrong!

Can someone retell the story about Trinity's death and how it related to the bolt? did it happen in the Matrix or the 'real world' (should be in real world if it supports the MwM theory)? My memory regarding Reloaded is fuzzy.

the bolt sheared, the guy on the gangway couldnt give a warning cos he'd fallen to his death, the Sentinels ripped the ship to pieces, Soren and his people couldn't complete their mission because they'd died on the ship, the emergency power came on, Trinity had to go in to finish the job or Neo wouldn't get to the source, even though Neo had foreseen something bad happening to her.. Cause and effect, a chain of causality. Yes it's in the "real" world.

Edited by - Tawakalna on 1/11/2004 7:03:19 AM

How about, the Machines lured Trinity into a trap? here goes how:

The Machines traced the source of the pirate signal, and pinpoint the origins to Soren and his men. Deployed Sentinels - now these Sentinels were not only assigned for a simple search-and-destroy, but also to bait Trinity into the Matrix. They knew these men had to be destroyed either by using Agents or Sentinels - thereby forcing Trinity to finish the job. The bolt was just an unfortunate coincidence - Sentinels are the operative factor here.

Far-fetched, I know, since Trinity could've bumped her head on her way to the plug-chair and has to spend time in sickbay and wouldn't have entered the Matrix. If so, then the Sentinels are also tasked with destroying the Nebuchadnezzar and kill Trinity in the real world. Either way, she had to 'die', unless Neo saved her. The Architect calculated everything.

Options and situations given to Neo:
1. Trinity enters Matrix (prompted by the death of Soren's team), and gets killed by agents. Neo must choose to save humanity (by returning to source) or Trinity (by not returning to source)
This scenario happened.

2. Trinity does not enter Matrix, but killed by Sentinels. This of course is less likely to happen (Nebuchadnezzar has not been found by Sentinels), but the Architect had to bluff. IF the Sentinels did find her, then the option goes like this: Neo must choose save humanity (by returning to source) or Trinity (by flying off to nearest Exit Point and unplug, then steers Nebuchadnezzar out harm's way, or warn them and charge the EMP blaster)
This didn't happen. Mainly because the Sentinels apparently failed to trace the Nebuchadnezzar. Architect was very lucky that his gamble worked (killing Soren).

It didn't have to be Soren. As long as any crucial part of the team is incapacitated and irreplaceable, this is enough to lure Trinity into the Matrix -they had to resort to this scenario since the failed to locate the Nebu. You have to remember that Architect actually networks with the Sentinels and the Agents in real-time.

oh b*gger this means I'm gonna have to watch Reloaded again tonight just so's I can deconstruct FF's argument. I'm gonna have to get Arch to proof read it for any erroneous tangentialisms.

and i'm going to get a dictionary so i can understand what the hell "Pretentious Pete" is on about.

get one for me too cos I just use big words without any idea what I'm going on about

you know taw, excess pretentious verbosity is bad for you

I "think" I have the answer, after some bath inspired cogitation, i think I've been able to reconcile both my own "bolt" problem and FF's analysis with some stuff of Kumari's. I've had to sit and watch Reloaded 3 times (again) to make this sound like sens (I'll prob get shot down in flames within seconds)

will post later when more time and I can run it past a few people first before I make a total @## of meself.

If you decide later to not post the reply because you think it's gonna make you look like an @$$, won't you have made an @$$ out of yourself in front of those people you consult?

I like the matrix and seen the animatrix but this topic is making my head hurt. its getting to confused.

"If I had one photon light for every idiot I passed on the street this world would be a brighter place."
Quote from thinkgeek.com's fortune page.

why do people keep looking too much into films like the matrix? is it because their life is screaming out for a greater purpose? is it because without such films then their life will be filled with films to be taken on face value and their phsycological-based education would be wasted, especially at their job as a popcorn salesman?

I'm not knocking peoples desire to look past the kung fu of the matrix, but it was something that occured to me in that everyone loves to disect and analyse the matrix until the cows come home and i just wondered why.


"when you develop and infatuation for someone, you always find a reason to believe that this is exactly the person for you. it doesn't need to be a good reason..."

Edited by - Arcon on 2/3/2004 5:51:17 AM

perhaps because in a way its about finding out about yourself.

Windows NT crashed.
I am the Blue Screen of Death.
No one hears your screams